Community, what are you doing?

Believe it or not, but I’m a very peace loving person and detest arguments and drama. Some have called me passive aggressive, but that’s a different thing!

Over the past years I’ve seen a lot of internet drama which, seeing everything on the internet always has to be so goddamn serious, has destroyed entire sites or friendships between people. Sure, I have been involved in some and in retrospective I wish I hadn’t been and wish things would have turned out differently, but it’s difficult distancing oneself when things are kicking off. In the past year I’ve mainly stayed away from most sites and left before drama was about to take place or didn’t join sites I knew were going to be involved in drama which so far has served me pretty well.

I don’t need to mention again how great Twitter is as I’ve done it ad nauseum before and the TwitLight series shows just how much time I spend on there. It allows people from different groups to have casual contact and works great as a tool between different communities and interests. And that’s precisely why it’s never nice seeing a Twitter fallout like it was on Monday involving @Trixie360 and @Haymaker360J [now renamed to @POLMGamer], as well as to an extent 360Junkies.

Here’s what you missed:

Haymaker360J: wonders what XBOX has for an answer now about the codes… .
Haymaker360J: @trixie360 any word on the amazon code screw up? .
Trixie360: @Haymaker360j I handed you off to the peeps who can help. It’s not something I can do anything about beyond that, sorry. .
Haymaker360J: @trixie360 oh ok oh well looks like I wont get an answer *shrugs* everyone handing it off to someone else .
Trixie360: @Haymaker360j no need to be snotty. I pointed you in the right direction and had your problem escalated. I CAN’T do more than that. .
Haymaker360J: @trixie360 so you are saying you cant go to that department and say hey whats up with this? forget it thanks for the help! .
Trixie360: @Haymaker360j I DID that. I’ve done it several times. Next time I won’t help at all. It’s not my job. .
Haymaker360J: @trixie360 you did? then silence is golden I suppose? since I only heard from you 1 time .
Trixie360: @Haymaker360j omfg! I exchanged like 5 emails with you trying to help you out. Do YOU do every task at your company? .
Haymaker360J: @trixie360 5 emails. the last one giving 1 update, and I could probably do every task at my company .
Haymaker360J: sad part about it is that the people actually lay down and take it up the ass from MS and like it. I am not one of those people .
Trixie360: i think i’m done with the Internet today. People fucking suck. .

Yes, the situation wasn’t great and I think @trixie360 did a great job trying to sort it out, even though it really isn’t her job in the first place. I have the utmost respect for her as a community manager. I can also understand @Haymake360J’s frustration, although I firmly believe that he shouldn’t have snapped that way and accepted the fact it’s nothing she can do and that she DID try and sort it out. She didn’t have to after all.

Overall, that was a rubbish exchange, but it’s not the main reason I’m writing this blog post. Twitter being what it is meant that hundred if not more people were able to follow the dialogue in real time and more later on when the repercussions were still ongoing and some of the things being said were shocking to say the least.

On with the situation, 360Junkies quickly demoted and distanced themselves from the situation:

I apologize on behalf of @360Junkies for what happened, especially to @TriXie360. He is no longer affiliated with us. No more douchebaggery. .

Overall, I can see where @seeson is coming from, but it does make me wonder if that move didn’t just serve cause more drama. I do think @Trixie360 can differenciate between a site and an individual and nothing during her original argument led me to believe that it was 360Junkies speaking instead of @Haymaker360J himself. Loosing the site he had put so much work in in the last months could only serve to fuel the fire and if I was in his situation I would have been annoyed, too.

Nothing, however, explains the behaviour of some members of the gaming community on Twitter.

A selection of Tweets I made during the fallout that I still believe are valid:

@Haymaker360J You really should step away from Twitter for some hours. You’re not doing yourself any favours with @trixie360 & everyone else .
@Haymaker360j *shrugs* It’s all your decision, but a Twitter fallout’s never been good. .
@seeson Dropping him from 360J seems a little drama inciting and harsh though? .
@leocomerlato All I’m saying is that yes, he’s out of line, but all the crap from people on Twitter ain’t better. It’s like everyone’s.. .
@leocomerlato ..trying real hard to get their best/funniest insults in. You know, all the people that never showed problems before.. .
@leocomerlato And sure, his behaviour is out of line, but to drop him from staff so early on seems wrong to me. .
@Haymaker360j Fair enough, I won’t bother to help then. Take care .
@leocomerlato Not really. You’ve got to give people like @trixie360 more credit than that! 1 ‘bad’ staff doesn’t make 1 ‘bad’ site. .
@leocomerlato I said ‘bad’. ;) Everyone makes mistakes and sometimes it’s better talking about things than publically removing from staff. .
@leocomerlato I don’t get the penguins thing? But all I mean is this is AFTER he was dropped meaning it pissed him off even more. .
@leocomerlato All this OMG drama should’ve been reduced early on, but so many people on Twitter just seem to pile on. .

I’m just going to link to some of the tweets here and here and here and here and here and the search for ‘@Haymaker360J’ on Twitter.

A large majority of the Tweets doesn’t show up on search, probably because the accounts are protected, but really, people, was there any need for those comments? We are a community and overall we all want the same things and to pile on with insults when something’s already happened isn’t the way to go.

Yes, @Haymaker360J’s behaviour was way out of line, especially after all that happened, but you all egged him on and didn’t let it rest. Is it that hard not adding your two cents after it all happened and just ignore him?

A related post by @mdk2002 explains things much better than I ever could, even though it’s on an unrelated subject. Some excerpts:

1. Be professional
2. Be polite
3. Don’t demand anything
6. Treat people like you want to be treated also known as the Golden Rule.
7. Use tact, which means, you can intelligently get your way without cursing or pouting.
11. No one is a god by any means; everyone is human and should be treated as such.

When did we go attacking people and to what means? THINK before posting and treat people with respect, even if there’s an argument. We are one community and there is no need to break apart at regular intervalls.

Note: Even though I’ve pointed out specific people and sites in this post, I do value every one highly and I’m only commenting on this situation, so don’t take this the wrong way. And I still think 360Junkies is a great site, even after differences and that’s not just because I got a free game from them!

26 Comments

  1. Posted May 6, 2009 at 2:50 pm | Permalink

    I can see both sides, too. Trixie did everything she could. It’s frustrating when things don’t work out, but Haymaker should have kept his cool.

    That being said, the people that pounced on him and took shots (like me) were trying to either help or diffuse the situation. I also think that it’s in people’s best interests to defend the community person that gives out free stuff and works at Microsoft. The situation may have been different if it were just one community member against another. In this case, everyone jumped on her side. There’s nothing wrong with it, but people have their own motivations.

    Anyway, I’ve had my fair share of squabbles with people and sites in the community. It’s been a while, but I know what it’s like to be extremely pissed about a situation.

    Bottom line is, this is a hobby and we’re all friends.

    Peace out!

  2. Alana
    Posted May 6, 2009 at 2:52 pm | Permalink

    What a jerk. Sometimes things get fucked up. What are you gonna do about it? I don’t like that this is my 3rd Xbox in as many years, but you don’t see me running to Trixie360 and yelling at her for not having MS come to my house and fix it. Shit happens, it’s how you handle it that counts. Go Trixie and all the other girl gamers!

  3. Posted May 6, 2009 at 2:54 pm | Permalink

    Yeah, I saw your posts and you’ll notice I didn’t include them as they were more sarcasm rather than anything else.

    I think there’s a difference between the stuff you’ve said and that some others did, that ‘fine line’ if you want to call it that. It’s just people need to think before they say something, just like in real life.

  4. Posted May 6, 2009 at 2:55 pm | Permalink

    @Alana, yeah, but still, I think there’s no need to go on. I mean people were giving him shit HOURS after the thing happened and just kept egging him on. He lost a site he’d worked on for months and everyone was against him.

    Not trying to make excuses, just saying, you know?

  5. Posted May 6, 2009 at 4:22 pm | Permalink

    I do admit I went over the line into name-calling, and that isn’t something I’m proud of, and will try very hard to refrain from that now and in the future.

    That being said, this person in my view is toxic. He has displayed a pattern of this childish, non-productive behavior in now two different sites he’s been prominent member of. As someone who owns and is de-facto head of a site, I have to protect my brand…so I completely understand how the folks at 360junkies we quick to fire and distance themselves from this individual.

    Going off on anyone in such a manner when it’s not their job or department to handle is unacceptable, and doing it so publicly is thrice-fold inexcusable. This person in question should take stock of what he’s done and his pattern of behavior. His “apology” was perceived by me as not heartfelt but as a way to justify his behavior. I emailed him back saying I want nothing to do with him because of his actions and hope he at least honors that he’ll leave my community alone. I too have to protect my brand. I then I filtered his email addy to go directly to the trash.

    Last but not least, I can understand being quite upset with having broken codes, but as the old adage goes, you catch more flies with honey.

  6. Posted May 6, 2009 at 4:27 pm | Permalink

    I had not seen an apology so far and I’ve not been privvy to an email as I didn’t raise my hand when he asked who else wanted to receive it. Feel free to forward it to me if you wish?

    And yes, your opinion is probably justified and it’s fair enough to mention it, it’s just the piling on by so many different community members on Monday really caught me by surprise which led to this blogpost.

    It was a rubbish situation from the start as I understand that there was quite a bit of money involved with the codes, too and I do agree with pretty much all you’re saying.

  7. Alana
    Posted May 6, 2009 at 4:42 pm | Permalink

    Right, I think it was out of hand. People get angry and upset, and things happen. We had a member of our forums do that, and sometimes there is no way around it. I know he was genuinely upset and I feel sorry for him, Trixie just happened to be in the middle. Oh well, it’s over and there’s no use promoting it.

  8. Posted May 6, 2009 at 4:43 pm | Permalink

    Sure, fallouts happen, just people need to think before making things worse.

  9. Corey Wallace
    Posted May 6, 2009 at 9:26 pm | Permalink

    hey lefty, why not mind your own business not other sites’ I didnt wreck anything. why do you think the junkies came crawling back to me? and the 10k? they were dropping FASTER then flies in the karate kid movies. you want to assume stuff, then get the facts before you run your mouth. as far as the apology is concerned, whos more of an adult the people that actually had the guts to apologize or the people who go crying and banning? like I said I have no beef anymore and its obvious no one really cares what happens to me, hell your wife chose not to unfollow me, but you LOL. live life to the fullest and keep on being a hypocritical person

  10. Posted May 6, 2009 at 9:45 pm | Permalink

    Not going to reply to most, Corey, but Lefty and Mrs Lefty aren’t joined at the hip and don’t necessarily have to be the same opinion and/or unfollow/follow the same people.

  11. Corey Wallace
    Posted May 6, 2009 at 9:51 pm | Permalink

    I am done commenting if you want to discuss my stuff further please do so you have my email address lefty

  12. Posted May 6, 2009 at 9:52 pm | Permalink

    I stand by my comments.

  13. whocares
    Posted May 6, 2009 at 9:56 pm | Permalink

    More importantly, the trixie asskissing displayed by the Xbox Live Twitter Community, not only during Haymaker’s incident, but every damn day on Twitter, needs to stop. It is very sickening.

  14. Posted May 6, 2009 at 9:58 pm | Permalink

    @whocares It would be great to put a name to the comment? Nothing is ever going to change if people don’t stand by what they’re saying..

    And yes, this situation wouldn’t have happened if it wasn’t Trixie. There is a lot of asskissing going on.

  15. Posted May 6, 2009 at 10:03 pm | Permalink

    In regards to Trixie…I don’t consider myself an “asskisser” but I am supportive when a giant game company tries to be proactive in reaching not only Indie game sites like The Married Gamers, but to the loads of folks that use the Xbox360. Same goes to the Sony Playstion group, EA, etc. I think the hyperbole was because most rational folks would have seen that the twitter attacks were very uncalled for.

    Did they go over the top…yeah. Was what this guy did over the top…yeah.

    Trixie can be unsettling at times, but others she has been a good contact to keep and has done the video game community a huge favor in organizing Community Play Dates and what not.

  16. Whocares
    Posted May 6, 2009 at 10:28 pm | Permalink

    @cat what does it matter? why? so I can be blacklisted/unfollowed/called names on twitter too? no thanks. the name has nothing to do with the comment. it just needed to be said.

  17. Greg
    Posted May 6, 2009 at 10:46 pm | Permalink

    GL in life, Corey. Seeson tried to make amends with you this morning, but you wouldn’t have any of it (Note that make amends doesn’t mean letting you back on staff, I think you pretty much blew any chance of that when you started making comments like trixie fucking penguins, whatever that was supposed to mean).

    See, it’s not Trixie’s job to help you–hell she didn’t even have to point you in the right direction, so I’m not sure why you suddenly felt entitled to an answer. But what you certainly don’t do is explode on someone in a workplace for the mess made by someone totally unrelated.

    Actions have consequences though, and after what happened with Trixie and the subsequent bashing of 360junkies and its members (who didn’t even have anything to do with Seeson giving you the boot), you’re getting what you deserve. Learn to keep your temper in check and don’t rage out in front of 1000s of people anymore if you aren’t ready for the possible repercussions.

    And for Carocat and anyone else who thinks the actions taken were too harsh: get real. When you are flying the community flag and representing something bigger than yourself, you’re expected to act accordingly. Maybe you weren’t watching the 360Junkies follow numbers go down through it all, but I was, and that’s the result when things like this happen–it gives the community a bad name. If you don’t think things like this happen in real life, then it might be time to wake up and smell your proverbial drink of choice.

    And Corey, about your content, it was gone the day it happened, so give it a rest.

    See you on the flip side (which won’t be back here).

  18. Posted May 6, 2009 at 11:12 pm | Permalink

    @whocares Personally I just think people should stand by what they say. There’s a lot of anonymity on the internet and it’s not always great.

    @Greg Glad I’m not the only one that didn’t get the penguin comment then..

    I did not condone Corey’s behaviour which I thought was obvious in my post and the messages I sent on Twitter which are mostly above. Trixie was right, Corey was not and his behaviour was way out of line. That doesn’t mean everyone and their dog should just pile on and on and on and on for hours on end.

    I don’t see how a community acting destructively translates to “wake up and smell your proverbial drink of choice”?

  19. Posted May 7, 2009 at 12:26 am | Permalink

    Like Chris said, I have to maintain the image of my brand. I could’ve handled it a little better by not saying “No douchebaggery” but that’s how I am when I get defensive.

    Corey, I took off all of your content the same day I banned you (the ban wasnt even permanent). I still thank you for the hard work you’ve done, but the fact of the matter is, you did represent 360Junkies when you were being demanding and impolite to Trixie. I don’t need to explain what happened, it’s all in the above story.

    I did try to make amends with you as a friend today but all you did was bark back. People tend to cool off after a couple of days but in this case, you haven’t. I can’t do anything else to say I’m sorry for what happened between all of us. I hope you understand one day.

    Good luck in life.

  20. Corey Wallace
    Posted May 7, 2009 at 12:30 am | Permalink

    greg, pull your head out of seeson’s ass

    if it wasnt for ME and Johnathan the site wouldn’t have been as good as you guys were hoping. I BROUGHT most of the people here to the junkies. none of the staff would do any work. Day after day week after week I ran contests to get people to the site, I paid out of my own pocket unlike some cocksuckers who use “hey I am a rep from 360 junkies gimme a code” as an excuse to show that you are actually alive and kicking on the site, rather just greeting people that join with the “welcome to the forums” post or writing a blog once a week. I said no to seeson because he couldnt man up to anything. lets bitch about people like Caro Cat behind their back but not have the cahones to SAY IT TO HER FACE. or how about bitching about Alkaline Prodigy and him trying to get codes for the site? oh hey he was being helpful but the whiny seeson couldnt handle “a non-staff” member helping the site. as for stealing my content, yes he did take it down but not before being told it was wrong to do so by people on the site. as for making amends, the only reason you want to make amends is so you had someone to do all the work for you.

    Lefty proactive? what the fuck does that mean? if you call proactive “being a fucking retard because the person you are helping already did what YOU DID (confusing I know, but it all boils down to me talking to someone on the phone, and her sending the email to the same department I just talked to), then she was sure as hell proactive.

    Enough said

  21. Posted May 7, 2009 at 1:09 am | Permalink

    Corey,

  22. Posted May 7, 2009 at 1:11 am | Permalink

    Corey,

    I don’t know you, I’ve never played with you. The only time I talked to you before this incident was when you said I was annoying because I tweeted too much. You then blocked me. This was when you were a 10k member. I doubt anyone will be able to take you seriously if you are going to resort to baseless facts and insults. Try acting like a mature rational adult and having a discussion rather than an argument.

  23. Posted May 7, 2009 at 1:14 am | Permalink

    Leo, to be fair, you were spamming Twitter the other day! ;)

  24. Pat
    Posted May 9, 2009 at 3:31 pm | Permalink

    I was aware of this incident. Never really posted or commented about it. This is another case of acting without thinking. Now I know corey in real life, he a friend of mine. But I have to agree with lefty. Being associated with someone that has been banned or demoted from two different sites, can prove to be troublesome. It is the right of the admin, to allow and deny as he/she seems fit.
    Name calling or “acting a fool” does not help the situation.

    On another note, if you are a writer, staff member and or moderator. You are representing the site in question, and so should act accordingly.

    But that’s my opinion

  25. Posted May 9, 2009 at 3:38 pm | Permalink

    Oh yeah, of course you represent the site, but you still need to be diplomatic.

    And I somehow didn’t make it clear enough, the main thing this post is meant to be about is the despicable behaviour by the Twitterati and their comments towards Corey. Basically:

    If you don’t have anything good to say, don’t say it at all.

  26. Posted January 10, 2014 at 5:19 pm | Permalink

    I do agree with all of the ideas you have offered to your post.
    They are very convincing and can certainly work.
    Still, the posts are very brief for novices.

    May just you please extend them a little from subsequent time?
    Thanks for the post.


One Trackback

  1. By In 2009 « carocat.co.uk on January 1, 2010 at 12:46 am

    [...] 2009 I got angry with some people in the gaming community. There are several repercussions that event had for me, including wishing I had started my own site [...]

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